Lowcountry Murder: Interview with Rita Schuler

[00:02:48.650] - Speaker 1

Well, when I graduated high school, I decided that I either wanted to be in the medical profession or be a police officer. And I was a little skittish about being a police officer out on the street. And forensics wasn't really big back then. It wasn't even hardly a word back in the sixes when I graduated, so I decided to go ahead and try my hands as being an X ray technologist, didn't want to be a nurse and an X ray technologist. Then we had a school, not too far from where I was born and raised down in the country there maybe about 20 miles Orangeburg, South Carolina.

So I went into training there. I had a two years training and was certified as a registered radiologic technologist. And during my time there, I got interested in the homicides that happened there in the city because the police officers, if they needed help with an investigation, such as finding a bullying in the body, they would bring them over to the hospital. And we had to go down to the morgue and X ray those bodies to find that bullet or even a piece of an eye if it would have broken off just anything they needed our help with.

[00:04:25.150] - Speaker 2

How often did that happen?

[00:04:27.850] - Speaker 1

We had quite a few. Really. One of the interesting stories was when I first went in training, I don't know exactly what it was, but when I first went in training and the first time that the police officers brought in a deceased body and they needed to find the bullet, the senior technologist came to me and said, okay, since you're a student, you're going to have to go down in the mall and try and assist and find that bullet for them. And X ray the body down there.

I think they wanted to see how shocking it would be to me. And I looked at him and I said, Man, send me on down there. And I went on down and came back up after we did find the bullet in the body. And I said, I am so interested in this. Next time you got a dead body in the morgue, I said, Send me. You don't have to worry about sending anybody else. So that dates me back, too. During my younger years, I was always really interested and curious about crime and how one person could do something to another person's body.

How could you shoot them? How could you stab them? And mom and dad being raised on the farm. We had newspapers, we had radios. And if we had a murder around the neighborhood or anywhere close, they would involve my brother and I in this. They would tell us about it, not to shock us, but to let us know the bad things went on out there. And that's when my little mind just really started turning. And I said, this is just interesting to me. And that's when I got interested in police work.

And even back then, you would read as to how they caught the bad guy. And that's how I got interested in it.

[00:08:04.830] - Speaker 2

So here you are. You're working in the hospital system and you're learning not just about anatomy and about the effects of different kinds of wounds or traumas upon the body. But you're also learning these techniques, these imaging techniques that are going to prove valuable for you. Did you sense that you had a career trajectory at this point, or were you just kind of taking things one step at a time?

[00:08:37.590] - Speaker 1

I was taking things one step at a time because as I said, forensics was not even a word back then, you couldn't hear it. It was more just investigation hands on. And we didn't have all those great technology. So I kept my career in radiologic technology for about 13 years, and I actually started down on the coast for about three months, and I was working midnight shifts and then a position opened up in Columbia, where I would be at day work. And that's when I went to the Columbia area, which is our capital of South Carolina.

And that is mid state.

[00:09:20.970] - Speaker 2

Probably a higher case load, too. I imagine a lot more work, right?

[00:09:24.930] - Speaker 1

Yes. We did have a higher case load then. Yeah.

[00:09:29.550] - Speaker 2

So how did you make the transition from working in medicine to working in law enforcement?

[00:09:35.250] - Speaker 1

Well, the way that happened, let me go back a little bit, too. I'll come into that in a few minutes. Sure. After about twelve years in the hospital, I kind of got burned out a little bit. And during the time of my Xray career, we were fortunate enough that we could travel to different States and go to conventions and go to seminars. And one of those conventions I went to was out in California, and during that time, they would give courses during that week, a different areas of radiologic technology.

And one of those courses happened to be forensic photography and radiology. Okay. And what that course was telling us? It showed us how photographs and Xrays got into the legal system in order to explain to the jury how the case proceeded and to try and solve the case. And my mind just started turning. Oh, my gosh. I said, I've got to be a part of this when I get back because I was already involved in X ray. And I have had a hobby is photography since I was a little eight year old girl.

My brother and I had a little brownie camera and we'd take turns taking pictures. And I had a hobby of photography. And I was actually doing some photography in the hospital when I was there a little bit in the not the emergency room, but the operating room. I was actually doing some operating room photography, nothing professional, but when they would need some pictures, so I would assist them with that. And during my time in my X ray career, my chief technologist had a dog room. So I knew he was teaching me how to develop film in that Gaudry.

So that's when I got my experience of developing film from the cameras back then. So I had that as a hobby, and I was loving it. And of course, my X ray career, I was loving it. But when I got back, I said, Man, I really need to get into this forensic pathology business and radiology. And when I got back to the X ray Department after that meeting, I was talking to one of my X ray maintenance guys, and I was telling them about the convention.

And when he listened to me, he Sariga, have you thought about maybe checking with the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division knowing a slide? And I went, no, I haven't. I said I hadn't really thought too much about law enforcement in my career. And the agents are here. And he says, Well, I've got a friend over there and his name is Mickie Dawson. He used to be in the photography area, but he is now switched over to the question documents area. So they need a forensic photographer in the photography area.

And I said, oh, my gosh. I said, I know Mickie Dublin. I said he is married to an Xray technologist that works at one of the other hospitals here. So that was kind of my connection. And I called Mickey, and he said, Rita, he said, we do have an opening over here. And he said, But I'll tell you, he said, I know they won't pay as much as they do it in the hospital. I said, word about to pay. I said, this thing is just fascinating to me, and I want to really get into the photography part of it and investigation part of it.

So that was it. I went, I interviewed, they did my background check, and I checked out. I got a job within a couple of weeks. And that was when I started with Sled. It was October 1, 1977. And that was probably one of the best decisions I've ever made in my life because I really did have a successful career there. And I want to bring in the first day I went to Sled, they were showing me around, doing a little orientation and one of the crimes, and investigators took me over to their area, and I was a part of the crime scene area.

My photography lab was a part of the crime scene area. I assisted them with all the evidence and all photographs and developing their crime scene photos. So they took me over to their crime scene lab, and they pulled a drawer open. And in that drawer, there was a picture of a dish pan. And in that dish pan was a disappearated head with a bullet hole in the side of the head right below the ear. And I don't know if they were doing that to shock me or whatever, but I looked at it and he said, Rita, are you going to be working with cases like this?

Can you handle it? I looked at it and I went, you know what? I know that case. I said, is this case happening in Pamflico, South Carolina? And he said, yeah, he said, how do you know that? I said, Man, I was a little eight year old girl, and this thing happened back in. I think it was 1958. Anyway, I was a little eight year old girl. And I said, this thing happened and it was all over the newspapers in our area. And mom and dad would read it to us and keep up on what had happened until they found the bad guy.

And I started giving them some history of it. And he said, Well, he said, I guess you want to see the wrestling fixtures. And I went, oh, yeah, I said, I really want to see that. So they took me and showed me all that. That was the first day I was there, and I just felt like, okay, I know this is where I'm supposed to be now. And that was my first day. That sled.

[00:17:01.250] - Speaker 2

That is something else. Sounds like they found the right lady for the job.

[00:17:05.570] - Speaker 1

I hope they did. And I believe they did. I was just connected to my guys, too. They took me in just like one of them. And after about a year and a half, they sent me through the police Academy. So I was certified as a police officer. And they did send me out on different other details. And they actually wanted me to be a field investigator at one point. And I went, no, I said, Please don't take me out of this photo lab and take me away from my crime scene guys, because this is what I loved.

[00:17:39.350] - Speaker 1

And my supervisor looked at me and he said, I'm glad to hear that, because we didn't want you to leave the lab. So it just all worked out fantastic.

[00:17:55.470] - Speaker 2

You get there. October 1, 1177. You had been on the force for about seven months when this case crossed your desk. May 27, 1978, was the day that Gwendolyn Elaine Fogles was killed.

That case file came across my desk, even though it happened on May the 27th, the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division, which I will refer to it as Sled. It did not reach Sled until the following Monday, which was the 30th. And when it came across my desk, they brought me the film that Walterborough police Department had photographed at the scene. Sled did not get called in to work this investigation, as some of the cases doing South Carolina Slade had to be invited in, and the police Department felt like they could handle it at the point of the investigation and gathering the evidence.

And they did a really good job with it. And then they brought all the Fem up to me to develop on that following Monday. And they brought all the evidence to the crime scene investigators for them to analyze, to see if they could get fingerprints or any kind of lead that would lead them back to the bad guy. And along with that film, they also brought lifts of palm prints, fingerprints from the scene itself, and the lifts. Just to explain it simply, they actually just put a piece of it, like adhesive tape on the lift and lift it up from a possible area where he had touched, say, the window or a table.

And they would put it on a card. And that's what they brought back to me. So they brought the fingerprint list, and they brought the palm print list that they had gathered at the scene of Elaine's house to me, and I photographed them and filed them in my photography folder. And then the crime scene investigators, the fingerprint examiners, could work with the print cars, the list themselves, as well as the photographs. I could enlarge them so they could look at them better. And that was my job.

My job was to photograph any and all evidence that came back from the crime scene, and we would have to photograph all the evidence before any kind of examination was done on it. Because if they dust it for prints, then it's altered. So we had to photograph it before. And then after they dusted for prints, if they could find more prints, they would bring it back over to me to photograph it as well. So we had those lists from the scene and any prints that our crime scene investigators found on any piece of evidence that Walterborough had brought into them.

Where were you when you first heard about the murder?

[00:23:24.730] - Speaker 1

I was in the photography lab when they brought the case over to me. Okay. And that was the first time I had heard about the murder. And I always get incident reports and synopsis of the case when they bring them in. That is filed in my case file as well. And that's when I saw the lien was from my home county, and the Fogal name was familiar to me as well. I knew some Fogles, but I did not know her. She was around my age. She was a little younger.

And when those photographs came in when I developed them, I had this eerie feeling that went through me because as I said, she was from my hometown. She had been in the medical profession before she left Orangeburg to go to Wallsboro. I was in the medical profession before I left the country to go to my training and then on to Columbia. And when I saw her in the photograph, when they found her body, Elaine was dressed like me. We dressed in little rug of shirts back then, and she had a little rug shirt that was pulled up above her breast and had jeans that were pulled down below her waist.

And they were missing. But her shoes were still on and around the house. There were things in her house that I had in my house, country things like stone, drugs, jugs. There was even an iron corn shell. And if you don't know what a corn shell is, one of my investigators asked me that, too. He said, Rita, what in the hell is a corn shell? Well, it's an iron piece of equipment that you put dry corn into it. After it's dried on the ear, you put dried corn into it.

It has spikes. And when you turn the handle, it'll shell the corn for you. And he said, Well, I guess that tells me that not everybody would have a corn chiller in their house. And I said, yes. And then she had different type tables in there like I had in my house. And the scary thing was that the metal fire poker that was wrapped around Elaine's neck. I had one of those Slam fire pokers in my house and that's when I just felt an eerie feeling that I almost had a connection to a land because it kind of just really hit home to me.

And when I found out more about a lien, as I said, she had left Orangeburg after finishing her medical technologies course, she went to Walshborough to work. She was 26 years old at the time, and she worked at the hospital for a little while, and then she went to work for a prominent doctor. There also is a medical technologist, so she was out in the public. The public knew her, the patients and she did a lot of community work. She loved children. She took them to ballgame.

Sometimes she babysat a lot. She worked with the children in the Church. She was just a lovely person, and everybody in Walsterborough because it was a small town. They pretty much knew Orland is coming in the doctor's office and then around town with her community work and Church work. And they love the Lane. They just said there was no more beautiful person in the world than a Lane. And also she had started taking art courses. She wanted to be an artist, and she had done a lot of just kind of home art.

But she was taking art courses because she really wanted to accomplish herself as an artist.

[00:28:20.130] - Speaker 2

She really sounds like an amazing woman, driven, talented, kind, generous.

[00:28:26.910] - Speaker 1

Very much so. Let's see. Joseph Flowers was the doctor that she was working for, and he described the lien as a hardworking, diligent girl. She'd go out of her way to help people, he says. I am deeply distraught over her murder, and it was difficult for me to accept. I don't know of any final person than a Lane. And I later learned from Elaine's sister after I met her later on in the investigation. And she said Elaine was my best friend and she was a tomborough growing up and loved to ride a bike all over Orangeburg.

We go to Edelsto Garden all the time. That was some Azalea Gardens in Orangeboro, the city of Orangeborough, and she worked at a nursery with our mom until she graduated from the technical school in 1072. And she loved doing all kinds of things with our mom and dad, grandma, aunts, uncles and cousins. And she loved to draw. She said Elaine just loved to paint and she started taking art courses, as I said. And she painted pictures and give them to our family for Christmas before she was killed.

So she was just a beautiful, kind person. And if you mention Elaine, even when I was into the investigation, if you mention her name Elaine Fogle to anyone in Walterborough or anyone around Orangeburg, they knew Elaine FOGL is just being a wonderful, wonderful, kind person.

[00:30:23.750] - Speaker 2

Well, I'm afraid we do have to talk about this part of it. Elaine was attacked about 11:30 p.m. On the night of May 27 19th, 78th. Her roommate, Nancy Hooker, found her. You write in the book that Nancy and her boyfriend came home late that night sort of early Sunday morning. Can you describe what they found? And I have to say for our listeners, this is a terrible crime. And your description in the book is graphic, but the details distressing as they are. They are actually very important to our understanding of the case.

Can you describe what they found?

[00:31:21.230] - Speaker 1

Yes. Elaine had babysat that night for some friends, and she left their house around 11:15 p.m.. So that would put her arriving home at about 11:30 p.m.. Now Elaine's roommate and her friend had been to a meeting down in Myrtle Beach, was probably 100 and miles away. And they returned to the home around 140. 05:00 a.m.. And when they went inside, they saw a Lane covered in blood, unconscious and partially nude, lying on the living room floor in front of the couch. They immediately rushed to the police Department, Walterborough police Department.

And it was only a mile away. And they told police what they've seen. They did not disturb anything in the house, and they weren't even sure if a Lane was alive.

[00:32:29.430] - Speaker 2

Oh, wow. Okay.

[00:32:30.270] - Speaker 1

And her roommate's friend did say it appeared that she had been beaten and was sexually assaulted. Right. The EMS arrived, and Walterborough police arrived immediately after that. And of course, they found that a lien was deceased. And then, of course, that's when they called the pathologist back then, Dr. Sexton, they called him in and also the medical examiner. They also called Dr. Flowers, too, to tell Dr. Flowers about a Lane. And he also came over to the scene. And that was back then. People came to scenes today.

It's a lot different, but there was some foot traffic in and out of the scene after the body was removed, too. But there was a pair that a Lane had come home that night, opened her front door. And when she opened that door, they believed that the person was inside of the house in the midst of a burglary. And when she opened the door, kind of elemental surprise. He saw her. And that's when he took the first blow to her and she fell right there by the front door because there was a pattern of blood dragged blood over to where her body was found down below the couch.

So apparently he had hit her there and dragged her over that couch. And that's where the rest of the happened.

[00:34:36.210] - Speaker 2

So she was surprised. But he was surprised, too.

[00:34:41.730] - Speaker 1

Yes, he was surprised. And that's when he decided, wow. And he just went crazy. But he was surprised as well as she was surprised. But he apparently closed the front door, locked the front door after he got her in there. And when the roommate and friend came home, the door was locked. But the light was owned inside the house. And that's when they thought that strange anyway, because the land didn't usually stay up that late. And they had heard her say that she was going to her mother's the next day to her mother's birthday party in oursburg.

That's when they thought it was strange. And when he opened the door, that's when they found her lying on the floor, blood everywhere. And it was just a horrible sight for them. But they just backed out and went to the police Department. Yeah. So.

[00:35:58.610] - Speaker 2

As you know, at some murder scenes, the victim is caught off guard, and that's just kind of it. The killer gets one strike and victim goes down, and that's kind of the end of the story. But in this case, there was a fight, wasn't there? Elaine seems to have fought back. She was dragged. She put up a life or death struggle.

[00:36:22.310] - Speaker 1

Yes. When the pathologist got there, the first thing he saw was that she had defense ruins to her knuckles and on her arms. And he said, this woman put up one hell of a fight against this guy. And that's one thing, too, that if she put up a fight with this guy, he may have had bruises and cuts all over him, too. But that was one thing investigator said she put up this big of a fight. He may have had cuts and bruises, or he was using a knife or whatever he was using.

He may have cut himself and made him believe. And that happens a lot, of course, at a crime scene. But the shocker was when they examined her body, there was a metal fire poker wrapped around her neck. And we later learned that her dad had given her this fire poker to keep next to the door for her protection. And that was what killed her strangulation. And then the matter of death was, of course, homicide. But along with all the beatings and the powerful blows that he gave her, the ending product was strangling her with that fire poker and fixiating her.

[00:38:08.410] - Speaker 2

How had her killer got an entry into the house?

[00:38:14.050] - Speaker 1

The investigators found that he had entered a back window. There was three windows on the back of her house, and he had entered one of the windows by knocking out the glass. And we know he was outside because the glass was not to the inside of the dining room floor, on the dining room floor. And he reached in and unlocked the glass and pulled the window up and got into the house. There was also footprints down below that window that was photographed, and there were very clear footprints.

[00:38:59.210] - Speaker 2

Was there any indication that as the killer was gaining entry, that they were wounded in any way, that this glass, this broken wood, anything like that, might have left blood samples on scene from him?

[00:39:19.310] - Speaker 1

There was not at the initial investigation that night, but again, him breaking the glass just like a lien fighting back. They were hoping for that possibility but at that night, they did not find any blood around the area. And they did not find blood until they went into the living room. And the living room was where the assault had taken place. And there was blood everywhere there. And back in those days, it could have been Aline's blood. It could have been his blood. We didn't have DNA back then.

They could only type the blood, which they did type it, and it ended up all being the same blood type, which was O. And Elaine had that blood type. But then again, the bad guy could have had that blood type as well. But back then, that's all we could do was type the blood.

[00:40:31.230] - Speaker 2

All cases turn on evidence. But this case turns heavily on the evidence that was found at the scene. You write that about 40 pieces overall were collected. And if we can, I'd like to ask you just a few questions about some of the key pieces of evidence in turn.

[00:40:52.590] - Speaker 1

So.

[00:40:55.870] - Speaker 2

You mentioned the fireplace poker that was by the door. Her father had given that to her. That was the murder weapon, the weapon of strangulation her clothing. There were some unusual aspects of her clothing. Weren't there with her dresser with her blue jeans, where they were found. Can you describe what was going on with the clothing in the house?

[00:41:21.530] - Speaker 1

Yes. When they were investigating, they found, like I said, her jeans were missing from her body, but her shoes were on, and they found the jeans on the roof of her little back porch. So apparently he took those jeans and threw them up on top of the roof. The bad guy when he left, that's where her jeans were found. They did find a pair of panties on the couch. They weren't sure if they were the roommates panties or Lanes panties, but at that time, they photographed it.

And again, it appeared that all the struggle and where she was killed was all in the living room area. They did examine her roommate's room, and they had gone in there as well and pulled out articles of clothing from her dresser drawer, some being bikini panties. And they were kind of throwing all over the place on the bed. And maybe some, I think, was in the trash can. And her little dog was actually under the bed as well. And he was just shaking and scared of death when the investigators got there and found him.

[00:42:57.130] - Speaker 2

Go ahead.

[00:42:58.150] - Speaker 1

Elaine's shirt. As I said, her little rugby shirt was pulled up and her breasts were exposed. So all that was pulled up as well, which and her underwear was missing. So that's when they thought, of course, that she had been sexually assaulted as well.

[00:43:21.890] - Speaker 2

Why were her jeans on the roof?

[00:43:25.190] - Speaker 1

We don't know. After I read the thing and after they did find the bad guy, I just kind of felt like he said, oh, well, I'm through with this now, and he just walked out and threw him up on the roof. Those are my thoughts. But people do crazy things when they kill people in investigations, they just do crazy things. And some of them have their own little signatures that they leave at every crime scene they go to. But I think this guy, he just kind of said, okay, well, maybe he was thinking he was going to take him home for a souvenir I don't know.

But he obviously took him out that back door and threw him off on top of the roof, which was crazy. But that's where they ended up. And that's where. And thank God the officers looked up there and investigators and found a gene.

[00:44:26.970] - Speaker 2

You have a sketch of the crime scene in your book?

[00:44:31.350] - Speaker 1

Yes.

[00:44:32.250] - Speaker 2

With the layout of the house, why did the layout of the house matter so much to this case?

[00:44:39.690] - Speaker 1

Well, again, entrance was through that front door when a land came home. That's where she always went. So I wanted to show how she would go in the front door and then the windows in the back, in the dining room area. There were three windows back there. Then there was a little back porch, and she would park her car on the side of the house and then walk into her front door. Or if she went through the back door and she would park her car on the side of the house and go in to the back door.

And because the front door was locked, that's the reason he found those three windows back there. And he got in one of them.

[00:45:36.830] - Speaker 2

The shoe prints in the sand you mentioned. Did we learn anything about what kinds of shoes were worn at that moment? What kind of shoes was he wearing? Did we learn anything from them?

[00:45:51.050] - Speaker 1

We did not see that in the report, there was a report of what the size was. Gosh, I can't think of what size was that, but they could get a size and they could get the treadmarks from that shoe print in the sand. It was very clear. And I've got to admit, during my career, we photographed a lot of shoes from persons of interest. They would bring the shoes in to me to photograph. And if they had a shoe print of any kind in blood or in the sand.

And I photographed the soles of those shoes, they could possibly match them back to the bad guy's shoes if we had his shoes, because there's always imperfections in everybody's shoes, even the way they are worn, or if they're little cuts in them. But this particular one did not yield anything back in the original investigation.

Ben (00:56:02):

You write in the book that there is a considerable amount of bodily evidence that was taken from this scene. We have fingerprints, palm prints, fingernail scrapings, blood, hair, samples from the rape kit, and so forth.

What did the organic evidence, what did the autopsy reveal about Elaine's murder?

Rita (00:56:29):

There was considerable amount of evidence taken from Elaine's body, as well, during the autopsy, and so that was combings of the pubic hair, and pubic hair was pulled from the skin, and fingernail scrapings from her left hand, and her right hand. And, of course, the black metal poker was taken from around her neck.

I'd like to say that at the autopsy, the pathologist told me that it took two people to unwrap that poker from around Elaine's neck. Then there was a huge amount of semen collected from Elaine, vaginally, and anally. There was a huge amount of semen collected, and the pathology, he was very meticulous. He put those into vials, and we had colored stoppers back then for the vials, and he had them all packaged up, and they were to go to SLED later for the blood analysis and the semen analysis.

He signed them over to the SLED agent to take to SLED headquarters in Columbia, to the laboratory, and the same thing with the fingernail scrapings, and the pubic hairs, they were to be taken to SLED, and some were doing at the medical college here in Charleston, as well, but the main ones went to SLED to be analyzed, and the reports filed.

[00:49:58.110] - Speaker 2

You're right. In this very unusual passage in the book that one of the great mysteries of this crime scene was her car keys. They were never found. What was going on with that?

[00:50:12.450] - Speaker 1

Investigators original investigators kind of summarized that they thought this was a burglary going bad. They thought the bad guy was in the house when a Lane got home in the process of burglaries and possibly back then, looking for drugs, that was a possibility. And being that Elaine worked at a doctor's office, that put another point in their head that maybe they were seeing if she had any drugs in the house or possibly if she had access to the doctor's office all the time, if there was any keys in the house.

And it turned out that the only thing that was missing from that crime scene that they could tell was her car keys. But her car was still in the driveway. And when they found that her car keys were missing again, Doctor Flowers had come over to the house that night. The doctor she worked for, and he immediately had Billy, her friend that came in and found her. He and Billy went over to his office and immediately changed the locks on the office doors in case the guys knew that the land weren't there.

And we were going over. And we like to steal some drugs from the breaking and steal some drugs. But that never occurred. And nothing else could be found missing in that house. So if it was a burglary, he didn't get anything out of the house except the car keys. And you would think that he might have was going to steal the car, but he left and the car was still there. But that was always interesting as to why the car keys were missing.

[00:52:25.650] - Speaker 2

So, Rita, let me ask you. The evidence that's collected on scene. You have the synopsis given to you by the investigator who arrives to write it up. But why do you think Elaine was killed?

[00:52:49.150] - Speaker 1

I believe that it was a robbery going bad and kind of a robbery. Murder, inconvenience. She walks in, and again, the bad guy is surprised and oh, my God, she looks at me. Maybe she recognizes me and a lien started fighting back. And we later found out that the bad guy did not like a woman telling him what to do or fighting back or any. He was in control and he wanted to be in control of her. And I think it was just the robbery going bad.

And then the murder of convenience. He just started beating her and he kept beating her. And he wanted to make sure that she was dead. And he ended up putting that fire poker around her neck.